mail archive Discussion of Open Streetmap in Ireland
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Hiking trails
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Hi, I noticed on http://www.irishtrails.ie/ at the bottom, there is a re-use policy link to http://www.irishsportscouncil.ie/Re-use_of_Pu... encouraging the re-use of the information. Is it OK to use this to map hiking trails with a tag like 'source=Irish Sports Council'? Cheers, Matze
On 19 February 2012 21:48, Matze List wrote: > Is it OK to use this to map hiking trails with a tag like 'source=Irish > Sports Council'?Servus Matze! I was assuming the answer would be "no", since previous reuse of PSI licences have had troublesome clauses in them. This one, though, seems good, so yeah, I see no obstacle. Except perhaps one... And this would make it completely out of the question: you can't tell where they got the trail geometry. If they walked it themselves, well and good. But it's probably more likely they did one of the following: * Traced it from unknown imagery, likely Google Earth * Traced it from Ordnance Survey Maps * Derived it from some official GIS sytem they have which itself is fed from OS data That being so, I would, before using any data, outline your interest, indicate your desire to use the data under the PSI licence, but asking for assurances that the tracks were not derived from a source preventing them from offering them so openly. This is, of course, a much more cumbersome thing for you to do, but you'll agree that the consequences of using the stuff in the wrong would be much worse... Dermot --
On Mon, Feb 20, 2012 at 3:38 AM, Dermot McNally wrote: > On 19 February 2012 21:48, Matze List wrote: > > > Is it OK to use this to map hiking trails with a tag like 'source=Irish > > Sports Council'? > > I was assuming the answer would be "no", since previous reuse of PSI > licences have had troublesome clauses in them. This one, though, seems > good, so yeah, I see no obstacle. > > Except perhaps one... And this would make it completely out of the > question: you can't tell where they got the trail geometry. If they > walked it themselves, well and good. But it's probably more likely > they did one of the following: > > * Traced it from unknown imagery, likely Google Earth > * Traced it from Ordnance Survey Maps > * Derived it from some official GIS sytem they have which itself is > fed from OS data > >Most of the actual trails are linked to other websites, like Irish Heart Foundation for the Slí na Sláinte or Coillte for forest walks. Some are locally hosted pdfs. The burren way for example<http://www.irishtrails.ie/maps/BUW%20-%20Map%...>has OSI maps with a disclaimer: "... produced by sports council ... should not be ... republished without permission from trails office ..." Now this permission they give, see my initial post. So i guess its ok, since we have most of the ways in the map already, so we're using sports council info only to put our ways into a relation, not tracing from the underlying OSI map.> That being so, I would, before using any data, outline your interest, > indicate your desire to use the data under the PSI licence, but asking > for assurances that the tracks were not derived from a source > preventing them from offering them so openly. > > The disclaimer goes on "...includes OSI data made available ... under OSIpermit no 8658." Is the Sports Council passing on this permit? If so, hooray.
On 20 February 2012 12:15, Matze List wrote: > On Mon, Feb 20, 2012 at 3:38 AM, Dermot McNally wrote: > The burren way for > example<http://www.irishtrails.ie/maps/BUW%20-%20Map%...>hasThat map (like most irishtrails maps) is definitely copyright by East-West mapping, who uses OSI as a basemap and add their own tweak.> OSI maps with a disclaimer: "... produced by sports council ... should > not be ... republished without permission from trails office ..." > Now this permission they give, see my initial post. So i guess its ok, > since we have most of the ways in the map already, so we're using sports > council info only to put our ways into a relation, not tracing from the > underlying OSI map.Considering the example of bus routes that often comes up and usually gets an answer of "can't be sure, better not risk it", I'd say it's the same with those maps. I think they definitely _want_ their data to be open, but haven't done the work to check that their upstream sources are compatible with their wishes. I've tried following the maze of policy links before to reach a conclusion myself, and concluded "Can't decide from what I see". For the record, http://trailkilkenny.ie shows theirs walks using a google map with a gpx file overlay (with a link to download the gpx). I contacted them late last year asking "Is the gpx file public domain, or can it be used for such and such ?" and am still waiting for a reply (maybe I should try again).>> That being so, I would, before using any data, outline your interest, >> indicate your desire to use the data under the PSI licence, but asking >> for assurances that the tracks were not derived from a source >> preventing them from offering them so openly.Yup, I think we need to ask for clarifications. Maybe if a few diferent people ask the same question, we'll eventually get an answer :)